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See reader questions & answers on this topic! - Help others by sharing your knowledge
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                     The FAQ Part 2

                     Volume 16      June 15, 1996

       LEGAL   This FAQ may be distributed or referenced in whole or in 
  DISCLAIMER:  part in any forum as long as the Author and Contributors 
               sections remain with any portion of the FAQ  that is 
               referenced outside of the forum, and no 
               profit is gained from the use of this FAQ in any forum.

                     SECTION 2: FINANCIAL ASPECTS

Q1:  I just bought this action figure, how much is it worth?
A1:  In more cases than not, its worth what you paid for it.  There are 
     many figures that have their worth inflated due to false demand 
     created by dealers, but the majority of these figures will drop in 
     price once it becomes known that they are available in quantity and 
     the dealer can no longer effectively absorb all available stock.

Q2:  What makes an action figure "rare"?
A2:  Very rarely is an action figure rare.  If a dealer has five or ten 
     of said action figures, then it is not truly rare, but falsely made 
     to appear so by dealer hoarding.  A rare figure cannot be 
     determined ahead of time, it is something that collectors and 
     dealers alike will probably not realize until the figure has come 
     and gone.
Q3:  Should I pay over retail for an action figure that is "rare" 
     because I fear I may never have another chance to get it?
A3:  I understand the anxiousness of wanting a new figure and the 
     aggravation of not being able to find it.  So I will tell you this, 
     I have never bought a figure for inflated prices that I did not 
     later see in a retail store for standard price.  Patience is a 
     virtue, and cheaper.  

Q4:  If I am too impatient too wait until I find a "rare" figure at 
     retail price, but I do not want to pay above retail price, what can 
     I do?
A4:  You can trade one "rare" figure for another.  If you run across a 
     figure that others are looking for, yet you still cannot find the 
     figure you are looking for, you can post a trade request and 
     chances are someone will have what you are looking for and will 
     want what you have found.  The best and fairest of these type 
     trades are ones where the cost, and not perceived value, are equal 
     on both sides.  And if your attempts at trading the figure are 
     unsuccessful, you can always return it to the store for a refund, 
     or sell it at cost so that you are reimbursed and someone can 
     acquire a figure they are looking for.

Q5:  Why does a question about worth or rarity evoke such an unkindly
     response from rtm regulars?
A5:  I want to emphasize that anyone is welcome on this group to discuss 
     toys or ask questions, but questions about worth or rarity do not 
     always bring out the best in the group's regulars (but you'll learn 
     we have a warped sense of humor, at least).  If you do ask a 
     question about worth or rarity, ask politely and in a well written 
     manner to do as best you can to distinguish yourself from a dealer 
     (dealers tend to post abrupt and sometimes illiterate queries), but 
     take the following points (from rtmer TZ) into account before you 
     ask a question about value, and you may be able to stay out of the 
     line of fire:

    "(A) Virtually  no figure released since 1985 is 'rare.'  As someone 
         else  noted,   two   hundred  and  fifty  MILLION   Star   Wars  
         figures  were produced,  so  even  these  aren't 'rare'  (since 
         so   many   tens   of thousands still survive on  mint  cards).  
         Most  figures produced after 1990  should  be  considered,   in 
         the scheme  of  things  'extremely common.'

     (B) Any  toy   produced  after  1993 is probably still available on 
         the toy shelves in stores,   the vast majority in large numbers 
         (i.e.  X-Men, Star Trek, Spawn, etc.).    Even the figures most 
         people  label  'rare'  are  still  produced in the hundreds  of  
         thousands:    Interim   Human  Torch  &  Invisible  Woman,  and 
         Phoenix, for example.  

     (C) Realistically,  most toys  are  worth $5-7,   i.e.   THE RETAIL 
         PRICE.  With a minimum amount of shopping around, you should be 
         able to find these toys at TRU, K-Mart, Target, or whatever.

         THERE.    They  are  most likely  NOT worth very much more than 
         retail,   unless  you have  some supply set-up worked out  with 
         your local toy scalper.

     (E) Just because  you  see  a dealer  selling  Professor  X figures 
         for  $10 each,   or  even Killer Croc's for $20,   doesn't mean 
         they're  'WORTH SOMETHING.'   (God,   I loathe that phrase...).   
         Likewise,   because  a  price  guide lists a relatively  common 
         figure  for  $15 (like Medieval Spawn repaints),  doesn't  mean 
         it's automatically 'WORTH'  that much.   Since  the guides only 
         track the secondary market (dealer/scalpers),  even if only two 
         M.   Spawns were sold at that price last month,   the price  is 
         marked at $15.   Meantime,  50,000 people probably  bought that 
         damn toy at retail at the local Wal-Mart.

     (F) Finally, as with all newsgroups,  IT IS EXTREMELY IRRITATING TO 
         OVER   AND OVER  AND OVER AGAIN.    If you want to find out how 
         much a figure is 'worth,' try this:

         (1) If  it's   pre-1985,   look   in  a price guide,   subtract 
             about  25%  from  the   amount listed,    and  you  have  a 
             'reasonable'   range  of  prices  at which it can  be  sold 
             (full guide price plus or  minus 25%, with lower-end values 
             probably more realistic.)
         (2) If it's post-1985, it's probably 'worth' (maximum)  no more 
             than $15  mint-on-card.   If it's post 1990,  it's probably 
             worth no more than $10-15.
         (3) If it's  post-1993,  it's  probably can be found at retail,  
             and is 'worth'  that,   unless you pay scalper prices,   at 
             which  point  it  is  'worth'   $10-15 for  a  more  common 
             figure,  and anywhere from $15-30  for 'hot' figures.   The 
             latter  price will probably drop down to $10-15 as soon  as 
             people realize that speculator frenzy rather than an actual 
             limited  supply is driving prices up;   this usually  takes 
             about  2-3  months  to sink in to the denser   and/or  more 
             impatient heads in the hobby.
         (5) READ THE FAQ."

Q6:  Is anyone interested in creating a 
A6:  There has been quite a bit of discussion in past and present on 
     forming such a newsgroup.  As of yet, no actions have been taken.
Q7:  Are sales/auctions/trades allowed here?
A7:  Yes, until a marketplace is created (see Q2.6), they will be 
     accepted on this newsgroup.

Q8:  How is an auction or sale usually conducted on the net?
A8:  From the rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting FAQ: 

     "Well,  the best way to do this is to observe several and watch how 
     they  are  conducted  and  then to  post  on  your  own.    Several 
     guidelines usually serve to help things run smoothly like:
       1. Make   clear   the  currency   that   you  wish   to   receive 
          payment   and  the form  in  which you would like that   money 
          (Money  order,  check  or credit card).
       2. Post  accurate  descriptions  of  the  pieces you are selling.  
          This limits problems down the line with miscommunication based 
          on  what was being sold.
       3. If you  have  an  idea of a price that you will not sell below 
          then post a minimum bid for the item in question.
       4. Post or [preferably]  mail frequent  updates  so  that bidders 
          know where things stand."

Q9:  How should I package and ship toys I'm selling or trading?
A9:  From Eric G. Myers (

     "This  is  an important question and one that has  many  legitimate 
     answers.   Just   keep  in mind that the sender is responsible  for 
     making sure  that the  item(s)  arrive in good condition.   Much of 
     this  depends on the toy itself.   The  first  component is a  good 
     sturdy  box  (Loose  figures  can sometimes  be shipped via  padded 
     envelope  without problems).    I suggest NOT  using the  'Priority 
     Mail' boxes supplied at the Post Office.  These have  a tendency to 
     flatten out during shipping.   I suggest finding some type  of  box 
     made  from at least some corrugated cardboard.   For  larger items,  
     boxes   from  liquor stores work exceptionally well (and they   are 
     free...a    definite   plus!).    Choose  a  box  size  that   will 
     accommodate  the  item without having to bend,  fold  or  otherwise 
     damage the toy package.  

     Next  you  need  to consider some type of  packing  material.   The  
     most frequently   used  material  is  obviously  newspaper.    This  
     can   work  effectively if you use some common sense.   Since  most 
     action  figures (as well as many other toys)  have 'bubbles'  it is 
     important  not  to crush the bubble  with  your  packing  material.  
     You want the packing  material  to surround the entire item without 
     crushing  it.   The goal is to keep it in place  and provide  extra 
     cushioning  should  the package end up underneath a stack of  heavy 
     boxes  during shipping.  Remember,  you are not stuffing a  turkey.  
     Crumpling   newspaper   works well when used   carefully.   Rolling 
     newspaper   into  'logs'  can also work but takes some practice  to 
     pack  an item securely.   The next level up from newspaper would be 
     bubble  wrap or styrofoam 'peanuts.'  Each of these methods has its 
     own ups and downs and is really a matter of preference and your own 
     experiences.   Go  with what works for you.  Bubble wrap can be  an 
     extra  expense  but  does  provide good protection   if   used   in  
     sufficient  quantity.   Peanuts  also  provide excellent protection 
     and are usually quite cheaply available.   Remember to  be  careful  
     with  the  use of tape on the inside of the box  or   with  packing  
     material.   Tape   that   is applied to a toy package may  not   be 
     easily removed.

     Once  you  have  the item  snugly in the box,  seal  the  box  with 
     appropriate  packing  tape.   Regular  thin Scotch tape is  usually 
     inefficient   unless  used   in large quantities.   Make  sure  the 
     address  is  legible  and  written  preferably   in   dark,   block 
     letters.   Don't forget to include your  own return address.   If a 
     mix up occurs with the delivery address,  you want the item to come 
     back to you rather than the dead letter office.

     Now   you  need to pick a delivery service.   You have several   to  
     choose  from.   The  standard is the United States Postal  Service.  
     Currently  you may  send up to two pounds via Two-Day Priority Mail 
     for  $3.00.   This is usually  sufficient to ship one or two action 
     figures  in  a suitable  box with appropriate  shipping  materials. 
     Occasionally  you  will  have  to pay a little  more  depending  on 
     various factors including the type of item, the size of box and the 
     type  of packing materials used.    The next most used service   is 
     UPS.   This  costs  a  little bit more but  delivery  is  generally 
     reliable.   In  addition,   UPS insures all packages for a standard 
     amount  (you   may increase this amount for a fee -  [see  Q2.10]).  
     Last,   but  not least,  there are many overnight shipping services 
     (Federal Express,  DHL,  etc.)   that  can be used to get a package 
     somewhere  in a hurry.   This is probably the least used method for 
     shipping due to cost involved.

     Last   but   not  least,   its always nice to e-mail  the   package  
     receiver  letting  him or her know that the package is in the mail.  
     Also  politely  ask  that  they drop you a quick note  letting  you 
     know when the  figures arrive.  With  luck and good planning,   you 
     will have made a  successful shipment."

Q10: Should I insure packages?
A10: From Eric G. Myers (

     "There is some controversy regarding this issue.  However,   if the 
     buyer  wants   to   pay  for insurance on top of all  other  agreed 
     terms   of  your deal,   by all means get the insurance  requested.  
     If  you are shipping an item of exceptional value (suggestions have 
     ranged  from  25 dollars on up through  250 as minimum  values  for 
     obtaining  insurance...a  happy   medium might  be   50-100  dollar 
     value).   Here are some of  the  controversies.  First,   insurance  
     will  often only cover the ACTUAL value of an item  as opposed   to  
     the   PERCEIVED  value.   What  that  means is that  if   you   are 
     shipping  the  latest,   currently  shipping but rare  Spew  figure 
     (let's  say Hamburger  Head Angela with Specked Panties),   it  may 
     only be worth what you paid for it retail.   It doesn't matter that 
     someone  sent  you $50 for it.   For  insurance  purposes  it  will 
     probably  be  worth   retail   price.  However,   there   are  some 
     exceptions.    If  you  have  an  appraisal  of  value  from   some  
     reputable   source,   you  may  be able to get more  back   on   an 
     insurance      claim.      This     is    very    difficult    with    
     currently available/shipping  figures.  No  matter the rarity,   if  
     its  currently available, its probably valued at retail price. Even 
     with older figures, sometimes  an  appraisal is not acknowledged by 
     insurance.  If you  have questions, contact your local postmaster.

     Second  controversy:   Insurance may only cover the toy inside  the 
     package  and  NOT  the  package itself.   Many people collect  MOMC  
     [(see   Q2.18)].   However,  if the card  or bubble is  damaged  in 
     shipping  and  the  figure  is left   intact,   insurance  may  not 
     reimburse  you.   Again,   check with your local postmaster if  you 
     have questions.

     In short, insurance is a matter of choice. Know what is covered and 
     then  decide for yourself.   Remember,   if the package you send to 
     someone else does not arrive or arrives damaged,  netiquette states 
     that the shipper is responsible for making amends."

Q11: Is there a preferred method of creating subject lines to indicate 
     for sale posts?
A11: It would be appreciated by all readers of this newsgroup if for 
     sale posts were posted with the "FS:" abbreviation preceding the 
     heading.  This will benefit both information seekers who are 
     uninterested in "for sale" posts, and those looking to buy toys who 
     do not wish to scour the newsgroup to find the posts that interest 

Q12: How should I respond to sales/auctions/trades?
A12: Respond by e-mail only, do not post responses.  Doing so is highly 
     improper and discourteous to other usenet users.

Q13: Should I inform this newsgroup if I see an item for sale here 
     cheaper somewhere else, will I get flamed?
A13: You may get flamed, but as long as you provide the information 
     politely, you are in the right and are helping your fellow  
     collectors on this newsgroup.  If the seller shows his/her volatile 
     attitude as a result of this information, you have also let 
     everyone know that they would be better off taking their business 

Q14: What does the C-1 to C-10 scale mean?
A14: From the rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting FAQ:

     "This scale is usually used to grade carded figures and boxed toys.   
     It  was  designed to be more specific and quantitative than a scale 
     based  on individual terms.    C-10 is absolutely  mint,   perfect,  
     free of defects.  C-1 is totally beat up.   What goes in between is 
     highly subjective.   No matter  what  anyone  tells you,   there is 
     no absolute meaning  to  this scale,  and each collector uses their 
     own relative grading.    It is best to continue to buy from dealers 
     you trust after you get a feel for their grading scale from some of 
     their samples.

     When    buying  carded  or  packaged  items,    always  ask  for  a 
     description   of all defects in addition to this C-1 to C-10  scale 
     grading.   Some  typical defects  in  carded figures and boxed toys 
     include  (but are not  limited to):   yellowed bubble,   edge wear,  
     creasing,  bends,  card is not flat,  bubble  is  crushed,   bubble 
     has ding,  bubble has dent (bigger  than  a ding),   tears on card,  
     bubble separated from card over a small section,  card  colors  are 
     faded,  cellophane ripped,  price tag still in  place, sticker tear 
     (from removing price tag), card is punched.

     The   prices  listed  in  price guides for carded figures  are  for  
     C-10  samples.   The  price  drops dramatically (sometimes to about  
     the   same price as a loose mint figure)  if there are  significant 

Q15: What does MIB mean?
A15: From the rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting FAQ:
     "MIB = mint in box.   A toy is MIB if the toy inside is mint.   MIB 
     says  that the box is,  well,  a box.   MIB says nothing about  box 
     condition,  an important aspect of value."

Q16: What does MIMB mean?
A16: MIMB = mint in mint box.  A toy is MIMB if the toy inside is mint 
     and the box that the toy is in is in mint condition.  Both the box 
     and the toy that is inside it must be in mint condition in order to 
     fall under this category.

Q17: What does MOC mean?
A17: From the rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting FAQ:

     "MOC  =  mint   on  card.    This means the figure is  in  original 
     unopened  package.    If   there  is any way the  figure  could  be 
     removed  or has  been removed,  then it's *not*   MOC.    MOC  says 
     nothing  about  the  condition of the  card,   which  is  the  most 
     important factor in the value  of  carded figures."

Q18: What does MOMC mean?
A18: MOMC = mint on mint card.  This means the figure is in an original, 
     unopened, mint condition package.  Both the card and the figure 
     inside must be in mint condition to fall under this category.

Q19: If something is MIB or MOC, does that mean that the packaging, as 
     well as the contents, are in mint condition?
A19: No.  If an item is being advertised as MIB or MOC, and you are 
     concerned about the condition of the packaging, you *must* ask.  
     Any honest seller will tell you the condition, in detail, of 
     anything you are going to buy, unfortunately most sellers are 
     dealers, and an "honest dealer" is a contradiction in terms (an 
     excellent example of oxymoron for English class), so if nothing is 
     stated specifically, ask.

Q20: What does it mean when a card is punched?
A20: From the rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting FAQ:
     "It  means the piece of cardboard for the rack hole is missing from  
     the card."

Q21: What is the best way to store carded figures?
A21: From the rec.arts.sf.starwars.collecting FAQ:

     "Your   best  bet  to avoid yellowing and other damage is to  store  
     your  carded   figures  in comic bags with a comic backing   board.   
     Place  the board  behind  the card inside the bag and then seal the 
     bag  with  tape along  the bag (taping the bag to itself).    Comic 
     boxes  make convenient storage  units for carded figures stored  in 
     these comic  bags.    Sealing carded  figures in comic bags reduces 
     damage due to light, temperature, humidity, etc."

Q22: Should I let the user's of rtm know if I've been ripped off by 
     someone dealing on this newsgroup?
A22: If all available means have been taken to ensure that the person 
     you are dealing with has not made an honest mistake, and it has 
     been determined, if possible, that the package is not still in 
     transit or lost by the mail facility, it is then appreciated and 
     highly appropriate to warn readers that certain persons should not 
     be dealt with.  You could save someone else the aggravation and 
     loss of money that may result in dealing with this person, but it 
     is important to first take all measures to ensure that you are not 
     wrongly ruining a person's reputation by reacting hastily.

Q23: I buy toys that I like, but I'd like to think that 20 years from 
     now they'll be worth more than I paid. How do I know if I'm buying 
     toys that'll do that, aside from not letting kids chew on them? 
     Isn't it worth anything to buy obscure figures that get cancelled 
     right away?

     From TZ (

     "There  are so many toys and figures being made and saved 'mint-in-
     the-box'  today,  that virtually none of them will be worth much in 
     10-20  years.   In  fact,  using experience as a guide,  many  will 
     probably  DECLINE in price,  as much of the current inflated prices 
     are  due  to speculation and new-item hype.   Just look at how  the 
     price of a Bane has dropped from $30 to $10-12, with no appreciable 
     new  flood of figures on the market.   Or Malebolgia from $50-70 to 
     $20-25.   Or  Clown,   Overtkill,   and  Tremor,   from  $50-60  to 
     essentially retail price.   Remember when Man-Bat was a $25-30 item 
     a  couple of years ago?   As Mr.  Mint (Al Rosen)  of baseball card 
     fame  claims,  anything marketed as a collectible usually ISN'T  in 
     the long term.

     The  other  things  to factor in here are  liquidity  and  relative 
     investment  potential.   Toys,  like  all  collectables,   are  not 
     considered liquid investments in that it is relatively difficult to 
     dispose  of them and convert their monetary value into other  forms 
     of investment.   If you own stocks,  you can sell them at virtually 
     any time you want with just a phone call; if you want to pull money 
     out  of  your savings account in a bank,  you can do that on  short 
     notice  too.   This capital liquity allows you to shift investments 
     into  the  most  profitable opportunities (those with  the  highest 
     percent  return,  balanced by risk factors)  on very short  notice.  
     Liquity is one important key to a good investment strategy.

     Collectables,  including  toys,  are terrible investments for three 

     (1) They have very low liquidity.   If you want to sell a toy,  you 
         have to (a) find a buyer who wants the toy, and (b) settle upon 
         a  mutually  agreeable  price.   There is no  standard  pricing 
         scheme  for toys,  and you can't just walk into the local  bank 
         and convert them into CDs or mutual fund shares.  This involves 
         a considerable transaction cost in time & effort, reducing your 
         ability  to  deploy your money into more  suitable  investments 
         should  the  outlook  for your  toys'  long-term  profitability 
         become bleak.   Toys prices also vary widely according to time, 
         region, and market trend, and it is entirely possible to have a 
         roomful  of  toys which simply NO ONE wants to buy from you  at 
         any  price.   Ever  try to get rid of 1980s-era  baseball  card 
         sets,  especially  1986-89?   These are essentially  unsaleable 
         items,  whose  market  value has dropped by  50%  in  then-year 
         terms,  and  even more so when inflation is taken into account, 
         in  less  than  a decade.   And you can't turn them in  at  the 
         supermarket for a box of Froot Loops, either! :-)

     (2) To a much greater  degree than "secure"  investments like face-
         value redeemable bonds or CDs, toys can depreciate considerably 
         with  physical damage,  and,  as stated before the  transaction 
         cost  involved  in speculating on them  is  considerable.   Toy 
         value is highly dependent on condition, which can change if you 
         happen to leave them where the kids, dogs, flood water, or heat 
         damage  can get at them,  or if you accidentally drop your  12-
         back Luke Skywalker,  ding the corner of the card,  and cut the 
         value  by 20%  in about a second and a half.   Also,  toys  are 
         bulky  items  requiring  considerable  storage  facilities  and 
         maintenance  (after all,  it costs money to heat the room where 
         they're stored, you have to pay property taxes, etc. the larger 
         your house is, you might need a larger apartment to store them, 
         etc.)   All  this  severely  cuts into their  profitability  as 
         investments,  as overall investment costs have to be taken into 
         account, not just sale value of the items in question.   And if 
         you  have  particularly valuable items,  you'll have to  insure 
         them,  an additional cost factor that cuts into your investment 

     (3) Finally, any toy produced after 1985, and perhaps even 1980, is 
         really "new"  (less than 15 years old),  and not a proven long-
         term secure investment.  In essence,  ANYONE who buys a toy now 
         with  the  expectation that 20 years down the line it  will  be 
         worth  considerably  more than one paid for it (remembering  to 
         take  into  account  inflation  and  transaction  costs)  is  a 
         SPECULATOR,  and  speculation  is an inherently risky  business 
         proposition, with potentially high payoffs (had you bought that 
         case  of  1985  POTF  figures  back in '85  when  you  had  the 
         chance...)  but  also potentially high risks (anybody want some 
         Pac Man memorabilia or Donkey Kong stickers?).  Hence,  for the 
         conservative to moderate-risk investor, they must be considered 
         investments to be avoided.

     The  other  factor to be taken into account is RELATIVE  investment 
     potential.   Simply put,  relative to the profitability/risk ratios 
     of  other widely available consumer investments like mutual  funds, 
     toys  are  a  bad way to invest your  money.   The  possibility  of 
     hitting  a  gold mine is far less than ending up with a money  pit, 
     and,  in  a worst case scenario (no one but the Salvation Army will 
     take  your  old toys off your hands)  you will have lost  all  your 
     money.    It  ranks  up  there  with  derivatives  and  risky  land 
     speculation  in  terms of the potential for a  financial  disaster.  
     Despite what anyone might tell you, the vast majority of toys, even 
     "popular"  ones,  are virtually worthless compared to the money you 
     COULD  have made systematically deploying your financial  resources 
     in other sectors.  Most comic stores make their bread and butter on 
     sales  of  new  books,  not because they stumble across  copies  of 
     Action #1 in attics every day, or even because Joe Schmoe sold them 
     a  Phoenix figure for $8 that they turn around and sell for $12  or 
     $20.  That's just simply not the way these businesses work."

--Scott Gordon a.k.a. Trekker Extraordinaire--
     See my home page, Coalesence.  Your gateway to Scott's Sliders Site, 
                         The Toy Closet, and more.

____________          _-_                                           ______
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       ||     / ,'   `---'                      (____/--------\______    |
    ___||_,--'  -._              SCOTT GORDON                       \    \
   /___      1:1 ||(-                __/____/__
       `---._____-'             {__________{
                     Maintainer of the FAQ

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Last Update March 27 2014 @ 02:12 PM