From grobe@netins.net Mon Sep 11 18:49:57 1995
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: grobe@netins.net (Jonathan Grobe)
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,alt.planning.urban,misc.transport.rail.misc,misc.transport.trucking,misc.transport.urban-transit,sci.engr.civil,uk.transport
Subject: RFD: misc.transport.misc
Followup-To: news.groups
Date: 11 Sep 1995 22:49:50 -0000
Organization: .
Lines: 65
Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net
Approved: tale@uunet.uu.net
Message-ID: <432eee$t6q@rodan.UU.NET>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Archive-Name: misc.transport.misc
Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:7479 news.groups:167244 alt.planning.urban:5939 misc.transport.rail.misc:1610 misc.transport.trucking:1531 misc.transport.urban-transit:27793 sci.engr.civil:11149 uk.transport:23002

                               REQUEST FOR DISCUSSION (RFD)
                        unmoderated group misc.transport.misc

Proponent:    Jonathan Grobe <grobe@netins.net>

This is a formal Request For Discussion (RFD) on the creation of a new
unmoderated usenet newsgroup, misc.transport.misc

Newsgroups line:
misc.transport.misc	Transportation issues.

Follow-ups are directed to news.groups - please honor.

RATIONALE:

While there are groups available for air, rail, trucking, and urban
transit transportation modes there is not a general transportation group
available nor a group for other modes such as maritime, inland waterways
and highways (other than trucking).

CHARTER: misc.transport.misc

misc.transport.misc is for the discussion of general aspects of
transportation as well as specific modes not covered by specific groups
(such as maritime, inland waterways, highway (other than trucking) and
pipelines).

END CHARTER.

PROCEDURE.

Posting of this RFD initiates a discussion period of at least 21 days.
Please post discussion to news.groups, which is a newsgroup dedicated
to the discussion of new newsgroups, and anyone interested is
encouraged to participate. Again please post comments to news.groups,
and not mail them to me.

Also note that under the Usenet guidelines:

The discussion will be followed by a CFV (Call for Votes), assuming
there is reasonable support for the proposal. The vote will be run by
a neutral third party, the Usenet Volunteer Votetakers (UVV). To pass
there must be at least 100 more YES votes than NO votes and at least
two thirds of the votes must be YES.

This message is *not* a Call For Votes (CFV) - do not try to vote: before
the CFV is posted, or by posting anything anywhere, or by sending e-mail to
anyone but the votetaker. The voting procedure will be clearly described in
the CFV when the time to vote arrives.  Now is NOT the time to vote.

DISTRIBUTION:

The complete official messages - RFD, CFV and vote results - will be
posted to these newsgroups:

news.announce.newgroups, news.groups, alt.planning.urban,
misc.transport.air-industry, misc.transport.rail.misc,
misc.transport.trucking, misc.transport.urban-transit, sci.engr.civil,
uk.transport

Please feel free to repost the RFD (in full, and not edited please) to
relevant mailing lists and other relevant newsgroups.
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jonathan Grobe  grobe@netins.net

From grobe@netins.net Fri Oct 20 18:01:42 1995
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: grobe@netins.net (Jonathan Grobe)
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,alt.planning.urban,misc.transport.air-industry,misc.transport.rail.misc,misc.transport.trucking,misc.transport.urban-transit,sci.engr.civil,uk.transport
Subject: 2nd RFD: misc.transport.{marine,misc,road}
Followup-To: news.groups
Date: 20 Oct 1995 22:01:35 -0000
Organization: .
Lines: 172
Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net
Approved: newgroups-request@uunet.uu.net
Message-ID: <46967v$e7u@rodan.UU.NET>
Reply-To: grobe@netins.net
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Archive-Name: misc.transport.misc
Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:7722 news.groups:170899 alt.planning.urban:7064 misc.transport.air-industry:3782 misc.transport.rail.misc:1983 misc.transport.trucking:2155 misc.transport.urban-transit:31037 sci.engr.civil:12370 uk.transport:25293

                     REQUEST FOR DISCUSSION (RFD)
               unmoderated group misc.transport.marine
                unmoderated group misc.transport.misc
                unmoderated group misc.transport.road

Proponent:    Jonathan Grobe <grobe@netins.net>

CHANGES from previous RFD:

Groups for transportation by water (misc.transport.marine) and roads
(misc.transport.road) have been added.

END CHANGES.

This is a formal Request For Discussion (RFD) on the creation of new
unmoderated usenet newsgroups misc.transport.marine, misc.transport.misc
and misc.transport.road

Newsgroups line:
misc.transport.marine   Inland waterway and maritime transportation
misc.transport.misc	General transportation issues
misc.transport.road	Road transportation except trucking, urban transit

Follow-ups are directed to news.groups - please honor.

RATIONALE: all groups

While there are groups available for air, rail, trucking, and urban
transit transportation modes there is not:
a. A roads/highways transportation group (other than trucking and urban
   transit).
b. A transportation by water group (including both maritime and inland
   waterways).
c. A general transportation group, for discussions of the dozens
   of smaller transport topics which don't individually require separate
   newsgroups, but which do need a home (such as pipelines). Hence the need
   for misc.transport.misc in addition to the other two.

Thus I am proposing misc.transport.road, misc.transport.marine, and
misc.transport.misc.

Concerning the names of the groups:

misc.transport.marine: While "marine" traditionally refers to the
oceans/seas rather than inland or coastal waters, current use of the word,
especially in industry, refers to anything on, in, under or near the
water, regardless of what water.  The "marine industry" deals with
shipping, contruction, maintainance, services, etc. related to all
activities involving the water.

misc.transport.misc: This is the standard name for a miscellaneous/general
Usenet newsgroup.

misc.transport.road: Road is a more general term than highway and is
better recognized internationally.

[An additional reason for the use "road" and "marine" instead of some of
the reasonable alternatives suggested is that they are fewer characters
long and thus quicker to type.]

CHARTER: misc.transport.marine

misc.transport.marine is for the open discussion of all issues relating
to marine transportation of all time periods. This includes essentially
all shipment via vessels of any sort.

The discussion will include, but is in no way limited to, history,
operations, customs and traditions, technology, equipment, political,
economic and social issues relating to inland waterways transportation,
maritime transportation, merchant/commercial shipping and the marine
industry.  This list is not meant to be all inclusive (it would include
such topics as decline of the us merchant fleet, cruise ship safety, ocean
liners, clipper ships, etc).

Discussions relating to navies and warships should go to sci.military.naval.
Inquiries about cruise ship schedules, etc. should be directed to the
appropriate rec.traval groups.

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:
*individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's items,
 memorabilia, etc. are permitted.
*announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and other
 resources are permitted.
All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

CHARTER: misc.transport.misc

misc.transport.misc is for the discussion of general aspects of
transportation as well as specific modes not covered by specific groups
(such as pipelines).

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:
*individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's items,
 memorabilia, etc. are permitted.
*announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and other
 resources are permitted.
All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

CHARTER: misc.transport.road

For discussion of all aspects of road/highway transportation and design
not included in other groups (such as misc.transport.trucking and
misc.transport.urban-transit).

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:
*individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's items,
 memorabilia, etc. are permitted.
*announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and other
 resources are permitted.
All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

END CHARTER.

PROCEDURE:

Since there already has been a month of discussion of the first RFD, the
discussion period for the second RFD will be a week or so (unless
significant discussion develops).

Please post discussion to news.groups, which is a newsgroup dedicated to
the discussion of new newsgroups, and anyone interested is encouraged to
participate. Again please post comments to news.groups, and not mail them
to me. Better language for the charters of the groups would be particularly
welcome.

Also note that under the Usenet guidelines:
The discussion will be followed by a CFV (Call for Votes), assuming there
is reasonable support for the proposal. The vote will be run by a neutral
third party, the Usenet Volunteer Votetakers (UVV). To pass there must be
at least 100 more YES votes than NO votes and at least two thirds of the
votes must be YES.

This message is *not* a Call For Votes (CFV) - do not try to vote: before
the CFV is posted, or by posting anything anywhere, or by sending e-mail to
anyone but the votetaker. The voting procedure will be clearly described in
the CFV when the time to vote arrives.  Now is NOT the time to vote.

DISTRIBUTION:

The complete official messages - RFD, CFV and vote results - will be
posted to these newsgroups (note that other groups have been excluded
from this list because of the 200 character limit on length of newsgroup
line for certain news software):

news.announce.newgroups, news.groups, alt.planning.urban,
misc.transport.air-industry, misc.transport.rail.misc,
misc.transport.trucking, misc.transport.urban-transit, sci.engr.civil,
uk.transport

Please feel free to repost the RFD (in full, and not edited please) to
relevant mailing lists and other relevant newsgroups.
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jonathan Grobe  grobe@netins.net

From votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu Thu Nov  2 18:13:07 1995
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: Kenneth Herron <votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu>
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,alt.planning.urban,misc.transport.air-industry,misc.transport.rail.misc,misc.transport.trucking,misc.transport.urban-transit,sci.engr.civil,uk.transport
Subject: CFV: misc.transport.{misc,marine,road}
Followup-To: poster
Date: 2 Nov 1995 23:12:59 -0000
Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers
Lines: 207
Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net
Approved: newgroups-request@uunet.uu.net
Expires: 24 Nov 1995 00:00:00 GMT
Message-ID: <12441.20187.290308@uunet.uu.net>
Reply-To: <voting@f10.facts.uky.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Archive-Name: misc.transport.misc
Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:7811 news.groups:172419 alt.planning.urban:7980 misc.transport.air-industry:4038 misc.transport.rail.misc:2044 misc.transport.trucking:2326 misc.transport.urban-transit:32114 sci.engr.civil:12744 uk.transport:26440

                     FIRST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2)
                unmoderated group misc.transport.misc
               unmoderated group misc.transport.marine
                unmoderated group misc.transport.road

Newsgroups lines:
misc.transport.marine	Maritime and inland waterways transportation.
misc.transport.misc	General transportation issues.
misc.transport.road	Road transportation, urban transit.

Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 23 Nov 1995.

This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party.  Questions about
this proposal should be directed to the proponent.  Questions about the
voting process, including requests for a copy of this call for votes,
should be directed to the votetaker.

Proponent: Jonathan Grobe <grobe@netins.net>
Votetaker: Kenneth Herron <votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu>

RATIONALE: misc.transport.misc

A general/miscellaneous transportation group is needed for discussions
of the dozens of smaller transport topics which don't individually
require separate newsgroups, but which do need a home (such as
pipelines) as well as general transportation topics relevant to several
misc.transport.* groups.

CHARTER: misc.transport.misc

misc.transport.misc is for the discussion of general aspects of
transportation as well as specific modes not covered by specific groups
(such as pipelines).

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.
*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

END CHARTER.

RATIONALE: misc.transport.marine

Currently, there is no place for the discussion of merchant/commercial
shipping, despite a good deal of interest in the subjects.  Such
discussions are generally contained in newsgroups that are not really
appropriate for the subject (sci.military.naval and
soc.history.war.misc, for example).  These discussions are also
conducted on various mailing lists, which suffer from limited readership
and limited accessibility.

CHARTER: misc.transport.marine

misc.transport.marine is for the open discussion of all issues relating
to marine transportation of all time periods.  This includes essentially
all shipment via vessels of any sort.

The discussion will include, but is in no way limited to, history,
operations, customs and traditions, technology, equipment, political,
economic and social issues relating to inland waterways transportation,
maritime transportation, merchant/commercial shipping and the marine
industry.  This list is not meant to be all inclusive (it would also
include such topics as decline of the US merchant fleet, cruise ship
safety, ocean liners, clipper ships, etc).

Discussions relating to navies and warships should go to
sci.military.naval.  Inquiries about cruise ship schedules, etc.  should
be directed to the appropriate rec.travel groups.

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.
*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

END CHARTER.

RATIONALE: misc.transport.road

Road/highway transportation is a very important transportation mode and
there is significant interest in discussing it.  Because there is no
group for road-related discussions these discussions are currently
conducted in other groups, particularly in misc.transport.urban-transit
or other misc.transport.* groups.  They are outside the charters of
those groups and add large amounts of irrelevant traffic to those
groups.  Additionally, misc.transport.urban-transit is gatewayed to a
mailing list, and mailing list subscribers find off-topic discussion
particularly irritating--since each post is a separate mail message.

CHARTER: misc.transport.road

misc.transport.road is for discussion of all aspects of road/highway
transportation and design not included in other groups (such as
misc.transport.trucking and misc.transport.urban-transit).

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.

*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

END CHARTER.

HOW TO VOTE

Erase everything above the top "-=-=-=-" line and erase everything below
the bottom "-=-=-=-" line.  Do not erase anything between these lines
and do not change the group names.

Give your name on the line that asks for it.  For each group, place a
YES or NO in the brackets next to it to vote for or against it.  If you
don't want to vote on a particular group, just leave the space blank.
Don't worry about spacing of the columns or any quote characters (">")
that your reply inserts.

Then send via e-mail to:  voting@f10.facts.uky.edu

-=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines -=-=-=-=-=-
misc.transport.{misc,marine,road} Ballot <MTMMR-001> (Don't remove this marker)

Voter Name:

 [Your Vote]  Group
-----------------------------------------------------------------
 [ YES     ]  example.yes.vote
 [ NO      ]  example.no.vote
 [ ABSTAIN ]  example.abstention

 [         ]  CREATE misc.transport.misc
 [         ]  CREATE misc.transport.marine
 [         ]  CREATE misc.transport.road
-=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines -=-=-=-=-=-

VOTING PROCEDURE NOTES:

Standard Guidelines for voting apply.  One person, one vote.  Votes must
be mailed directly from the voter to the votetaker.  Anonymous,
forwarded or proxy votes are not valid; this includes votes generated by
WWW/HTML/CGI forms.

Vote counting is automated.  Failure to follow these directions may mean
that your vote does not get counted.  If you do not receive an
acknowledgment of your vote within three days, contact the votetaker
about the problem.  It's your responsibility to make sure your vote is
registered correctly.  Duplicate votes are resolved in favor of the most
recent valid vote.  Addresses and votes of all voters will be published
in the final voting results post.

The purpose of a Usenet vote is to determine the genuine interest of
persons who would read a proposed newsgroup.  Soliciting votes from
disinterested parties defeats this purpose.  Please do not distribute
this CFV.  If you must, direct people to the official CFV as posted to
news.announce.newgroups.  Distributing pre-marked or otherwise edited
copies of this CFV is generally considered to be vote fraud.  When in
doubt, ask the votetaker.


DISTRIBUTION:

This call for votes is being posted to the following newsgroups:

	news.announce.newgroups		news.groups
	alt.planning.urban		misc.transport.air-industry
	misc.transport.rail.misc	misc.transport.trucking
	misc.transport.urban-transit	sci.engr.civil
	uk.transport

This call for votes is also being sent to these mailing lists:

	 DOT (Departments of Transportation)
	 dot@vm1.nodak.edu

	 Ships
	 ships@access.digex.net

	 transp-l (Transportaton)
	 transp-l@gmu.edu

	 marine-tech
	 marine-tech@mailbase.ac.uk

From votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu Wed Nov 15 13:06:02 1995
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: Kenneth Herron <votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu>
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,alt.planning.urban,misc.transport.air-industry,misc.transport.rail.misc,misc.transport.trucking,misc.transport.urban-transit,sci.engr.civil,uk.transport
Subject: 2nd CFV: misc.transport.{misc,marine,road}
Supersedes: <12441.20187.290308@uunet.uu.net>
Followup-To: poster
Date: 15 Nov 1995 18:05:55 -0000
Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers
Lines: 204
Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net
Approved: newgroups-request@uunet.uu.net
Expires: 24 Nov 1995 00:00:00 GMT
Message-ID: <816458751.13904@uunet.uu.net>
References: <12441.20187.290308@uunet.uu.net>
Reply-To: <voting@f10.facts.uky.edu>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Archive-Name: misc.transport.misc
Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:7882 news.groups:174203 alt.planning.urban:8846 misc.transport.air-industry:4322 misc.transport.rail.misc:2182 misc.transport.trucking:2528 misc.transport.urban-transit:33290 sci.engr.civil:13133 uk.transport:27722

                      LAST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2)
                unmoderated group misc.transport.misc
               unmoderated group misc.transport.marine
                unmoderated group misc.transport.road

Newsgroups lines:
misc.transport.marine	Maritime and inland waterways transportation.
misc.transport.misc	General transportation issues.
misc.transport.road	Road and highway transportation.

Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 23 Nov 1995.

This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party.  Questions about
this proposal should be directed to the proponent.  Questions about the
voting process, including requests for a copy of this call for votes,
should be directed to the votetaker.

Proponent: Jonathan Grobe <grobe@netins.net>
Votetaker: Kenneth Herron <votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu>

RATIONALE: misc.transport.misc

A general/miscellaneous transportation group is needed for discussions
of the dozens of smaller transport topics which don't individually
require separate newsgroups, but which do need a home (such as
pipelines) as well as general transportation topics relevant to several
misc.transport.* groups.

CHARTER: misc.transport.misc

misc.transport.misc is for the discussion of general aspects of
transportation as well as specific modes not covered by specific groups
(such as pipelines).

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.
*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

END CHARTER.

RATIONALE: misc.transport.marine

Currently, there is no place for the discussion of merchant/commercial
shipping, despite a good deal of interest in the subjects.  Such
discussions are generally contained in newsgroups that are not really
appropriate for the subject (sci.military.naval and
soc.history.war.misc, for example).  These discussions are also
conducted on various mailing lists, which suffer from limited readership
and limited accessibility.

CHARTER: misc.transport.marine

misc.transport.marine is for the open discussion of all issues relating
to marine transportation of all time periods.  This includes essentially
all shipment via vessels of any sort.

The discussion will include, but is in no way limited to, history,
operations, customs and traditions, technology, equipment, political,
economic and social issues relating to inland waterways transportation,
maritime transportation, merchant/commercial shipping and the marine
industry.  This list is not meant to be all inclusive (it would also
include such topics as decline of the US merchant fleet, cruise ship
safety, ocean liners, clipper ships, etc).

Discussions relating to navies and warships should go to
sci.military.naval.  Inquiries about cruise ship schedules, etc.  should
be directed to the appropriate rec.travel groups.

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.
*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

END CHARTER.

RATIONALE: misc.transport.road

Road/highway transportation is a very important transportation mode and
there is significant interest in discussing it.  Because there is no
group for road-related discussions these discussions are currently
conducted in other groups, particularly in misc.transport.urban-transit
or other misc.transport.* groups.  They are outside the charters of
those groups and add large amounts of irrelevant traffic to those
groups.  Additionally, misc.transport.urban-transit is gatewayed to a
mailing list, and mailing list subscribers find off-topic discussion
particularly irritating--since each post is a separate mail message.

CHARTER: misc.transport.road

misc.transport.road is for discussion of all aspects of road/highway
transportation and design not included in other groups (such as
misc.transport.trucking and misc.transport.urban-transit).

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.

*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

END CHARTER.

HOW TO VOTE

Erase everything above the top "-=-=-=-" line and erase everything below
the bottom "-=-=-=-" line.  Do not erase anything between these lines
and do not change the group names.

Give your name on the line that asks for it.  For each group, place a
YES or NO in the brackets next to it to vote for or against it.  If you
don't want to vote on a particular group, just leave the space blank.
Don't worry about spacing of the columns or any quote characters (">")
that your reply inserts.

Then send via e-mail to:  voting@f10.facts.uky.edu

-=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines -=-=-=-=-=-
misc.transport.{misc,marine,road} Ballot <MTMMR-002> (Don't remove this marker)

Voter Name:

 [Your Vote]  Group
-----------------------------------------------------------------
 [ YES     ]  example.yes.vote
 [ NO      ]  example.no.vote
 [ ABSTAIN ]  example.abstention

 [         ]  CREATE misc.transport.misc
 [         ]  CREATE misc.transport.marine
 [         ]  CREATE misc.transport.road
-=-=-=-=-=- Don't Delete Anything Between These Lines -=-=-=-=-=-

VOTING PROCEDURE NOTES:

Standard Guidelines for voting apply.  One person, one vote.  Votes must
be mailed directly from the voter to the votetaker.  Anonymous,
forwarded or proxy votes are not valid; this includes votes generated by
WWW/HTML/CGI forms.

Vote counting is automated.  Failure to follow these directions may mean
that your vote does not get counted.  If you do not receive an
acknowledgment of your vote within three days, contact the votetaker
about the problem.  It's your responsibility to make sure your vote is
registered correctly.  Duplicate votes are resolved in favor of the most
recent valid vote.  Addresses and votes of all voters will be published
in the final voting results post.

The purpose of a Usenet vote is to determine the genuine interest of
persons who would read a proposed newsgroup.  Soliciting votes from
disinterested parties defeats this purpose.  Please do not distribute
this CFV.  If you must, direct people to the official CFV as posted to
news.announce.newgroups.  Distributing pre-marked or otherwise edited
copies of this CFV is generally considered to be vote fraud.  When in
doubt, ask the votetaker.

misc.transport.{misc,marine,road} Acknowledgement Bounce List
No need to revote
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3637@compuserve.com                                                   L.H. Boyd
brett@utexas.edu                           Brett Leach <brettl@mail.utexas.edu>
rhall@campus.mci.net                                               Richard Hall

Invalid ballots
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
rdouglas@nova.umuc.edu                                       Robert D. Douglass
    ! No vote statement in message

DISTRIBUTION:

This call for votes is being posted to the following newsgroups:

	news.announce.newgroups		news.groups
	alt.planning.urban		misc.transport.air-industry
	misc.transport.rail.misc	misc.transport.trucking
	misc.transport.urban-transit	sci.engr.civil
	uk.transport

From votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu Mon Nov 27 09:21:18 1995
Path: uunet!bounce-back
From: Kenneth Herron <votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu>
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,alt.planning.urban,misc.transport.air-industry,misc.transport.rail.misc,misc.transport.trucking,misc.transport.urban-transit,sci.engr.civil,uk.transport
Subject: RESULT: misc.transport.{misc,marine,road} all groups pass
Supersedes: <816458751.13904@uunet.uu.net>
Followup-To: news.groups
Date: 27 Nov 1995 09:21:11 -0500
Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers
Lines: 354
Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net
Approved: newgroups-request@uunet.uu.net
Message-ID: <817482066.14960@uunet.uu.net>
References: <12441.20187.290308@uunet.uu.net> <816458751.13904@uunet.uu.net>
NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net
Archive-Name: misc.transport.misc
Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:7938 news.groups:176282 alt.planning.urban:9802 misc.transport.air-industry:4468 misc.transport.rail.misc:2230 misc.transport.trucking:2700 misc.transport.urban-transit:34302 sci.engr.civil:13346 uk.transport:28634

                                RESULT
         unmoderated group misc.transport.misc passes 168:25
        unmoderated group misc.transport.marine passes 165:22
         unmoderated group misc.transport.road passes 162:26

misc.transport.{misc,marine,road} results - 227 valid votes

 Yes  No  | 2/3 >100 | Pass | Group
---- ---- | --- ---- | ---- | -------------------------------------------
 168   25 | Yes  Yes |  Yes | misc.transport.misc
 165   22 | Yes  Yes |  Yes | misc.transport.marine
 162   26 | Yes  Yes |  Yes | misc.transport.road
   3 invalid ballots

A five day discussion period follows this announcement.  If no
serious allegations of voting irregularities are raised, the
moderator of news.announce.newgroups will create the groups shortly
thereafter.

Newsgroups lines:
misc.transport.marine	Maritime and inland waterways transportation.
misc.transport.misc	General transportation issues.
misc.transport.road	Road and highway transportation.

Voting closed at 23:59:59 UTC, 23 Nov 1995.

This vote was conducted by a neutral third party.  Questions about
this proposal should be directed to the proponent.  Questions about the
voting process, including requests for a copy of this call for votes,
should be directed to the votetaker.

Proponent: Jonathan Grobe <grobe@netins.net>
Votetaker: Kenneth Herron <votetaker@f10.facts.uky.edu>

CHARTER: misc.transport.misc

misc.transport.misc is for the discussion of general aspects of
transportation as well as specific modes not covered by specific groups
(such as pipelines).

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.
*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

END CHARTER.

CHARTER: misc.transport.marine

misc.transport.marine is for the open discussion of all issues relating
to marine transportation of all time periods.  This includes essentially
all shipment via vessels of any sort.

The discussion will include, but is in no way limited to, history,
operations, customs and traditions, technology, equipment, political,
economic and social issues relating to inland waterways transportation,
maritime transportation, merchant/commercial shipping and the marine
industry.  This list is not meant to be all inclusive (it would also
include such topics as decline of the US merchant fleet, cruise ship
safety, ocean liners, clipper ships, etc).

Discussions relating to navies and warships should go to
sci.military.naval.  Inquiries about cruise ship schedules, etc.  should
be directed to the appropriate rec.travel groups.

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.
*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

Binary and encoded posts of any sort are prohibited.

END CHARTER.

CHARTER: misc.transport.road

misc.transport.road is for discussion of all aspects of road/highway
transportation and design not included in other groups (such as
misc.transport.trucking and misc.transport.urban-transit).

Commercial posts and advertising are not appropriate for this group,
with the following exceptions:

*       individuals seeking to buy or sell books, magazines, collector's
	items, memorabilia, etc.  are permitted.

*       announcements of commercial or semi-commercial web sites and
	other resources are permitted.

All such commercial or advertising posts should be brief, should not be
posted repeatedly and must be clearly related to the topics the group is
meant to discuss.  Frequent reposting of the same or similar articles is
specifically prohibited.

END CHARTER.

misc.transport.{misc,marine,road} Final Voter list
                                                     misc.transport.road -----+
                                                   misc.transport.marine ----+|
                                                     misc.transport.misc ---+||
                                                                            |||
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PAVLIK@Pap.UniVie.AC.AT                                      Andreas Pavlik NYN
jleishma@ozemail.com.au               john leishman jleishma@ozemail.com.au YYY
mincad@ozemail.com.au                                          Leigh Wardle YYY
yap@ENG2.eng.monash.edu.au                                     Mow Ying Yap YYY
hutchij@epsmtp.dep.sa.gov.au                               HUTCHINSON, John YYY
nwaller@lands.sa.gov.au                                                     YY-
rodsmith@werple.mira.net.au                                  Roderick Smith YY-
peterm@peninsula.starway.net.au                                Peter Mackie Y-Y
Oleg_I._Sannikov@ieaust.org.au                             Oleg I. Sannikov Y-Y
N.Dow@msl.oz.au                                                     Nik Dow YYN
jan.coekelberghs@ping.be                                   Jan Coekelberghs N--
richard@mindlink.bc.ca                                      Richard Hennick YYY
kheard@ccs.carleton.ca                                            Ken Heard YYY
ae446@freenet.carleton.ca                                       Nigel Allen YYY
ag414@freenet.carleton.ca                                       Colin Leech YYY
kshapiro@cyberus.ca                                            Kivi Shapiro YYY
kmitchel@direct.ca                                           Kevin Mitchell NNN
paul@dciem.dnd.ca                                               Paul Sarkar YYY
canship@public.compusult.nf.ca                        Capt. Sidney J. Hynes YYY
GOSSEJ@nautical.nscc.ns.ca                                     Joseph Gosse YYY
ah615@freenet.toronto.on.ca                         Herbert Villatoro, P.E. Y-Y
bx967@freenet.toronto.on.ca                                  John McCormick YYY
mnowacki@wchat.on.ca                                           Mike Nowacki YYY
edmonds@cs.ubc.ca                                             Brian Edmonds Y--
staylor@unixg.ubc.ca                                   staylor@unixg.ubc.ca YY-
jabraham@acs.ucalgary.ca                                       John Abraham Y-Y
rad@unb.ca                                     Robert A Douglas, rad@unb.ca Y-Y
has200@dvinci.usask.ca                                      Hamid Soleymani --Y
devuns@alsys.com                                     Olivier Devuns @pulsar NYY
ATDUSA@aol.com                                                 Daniel Reiss YYN
CaptJHEM@aol.com                                  Capt. James H. E. Maugham YYY
Catamaman@aol.com                                           James O'Connell -N-
Cpoltenson@aol.com                                     Charles A. Poltenson YYN
JakeKPS94@aol.com                                       Jacob J. DesVergers YYY
KNHBG@aol.com                                   Kai Gerber (Kuehne & Nagel) YYY
PTLIGGETT@aol.com                                        PTLIGGETT @AOL.COM YYY
SeaPhoto@aol.com                                                            YYY
stainles@bga.com                                               Dwight Brown NNN
mitch@CellNet.com                                                Mitch Sako YYY
paulr@cmysys.com                                               Paul Russell -YY
100572.3563@compuserve.com                                   Han Vallenduuk --Y
3637@compuserve.com                                               L.H. Boyd YYY
70703.2064@compuserve.com                                     Fred Hillmann -Y-
76566.1411@compuserve.com                                 Christopher Booth Y-Y
bsbonney@cris.com                                     Benton StJ Bonney, PE --Y
mchance@crl.com                                           Michael A. Chance YYY
crouchkp@flidh101.delcoelect.com                                  K. Crouch ---
aglass@delphi.com                                                Adam Glass -YN
MICHLOHEARN@delphi.com                                      Michael O'Hearn YYY
bwilcox@hopf.dnai.com                                          Bruce Wilcox -Y-
icey@crofts.dungeon.com                                        Mark E. Owen YYY
jrm@globalvillag.com                                  John R. MacWilliamson NNN
guru@gol.com                                                    Gururaj Rao -Y-
jpgs@gte.com                                            James P.G. Sterbenz YYY
mgillman@halcyon.com                                        Michael Gillman YYY
bjv@herbison.com                                              B.J. Herbison Y--
robhitch@iafrica.com                                 John P L Morgan Pr Eng YYY
dmoorman@interaccess.com                                       Dave Moorman YYY
ir001367@interramp.com                                                      YYN
dwinters@io.com                                               David Winters YYY
bremond@gramercy.ios.com                                        Bryan Emond YYY
pireland@islandnet.com      Peter Ireland Ctech.   <pireland@islandnet.com> Y-Y
rajames@IslandNet.com                                         Richard James YYY
janyce@janyce.com                                               Janyce Rein Y-Y
hrose@rocza.kei.com                                     Helen Trillian Rose YYY
jcoglianese@lfs.loral.com                                 Jeanne Coglianese Y-Y
standlee@lunacity.com                                        KEVIN STANDLEE YYY
yondar@infoweb.magi.com                                        G. Ray Gompf YYY
SF/SFPOST2/JQO%Matson_Navigation_Co+p@mcimail.com             Jonathan Ogle NYY
dhartung@mcs.com                                                Dan Hartung YYY
stchrysler@mmm.com                                           Susan Chrysler Y-Y
bdp1@ix.netcom.com                      Barry D. Parker  bdp1@ix.netcom.com YY-
MHauler@ix.netcom.com                                          Charles Witt Y-Y
mreap@ix.netcom.com                                            Michael Reap YYY
nelsonk@ix.netcom.com                                            Ken Nelson YYY
pchase@ix.netcom.com                     Peter Chase <pchase@ix.netcom.com> YYY
pmarr@ix.netcom.com          PAUL MARR e-mail address:  pmarr@ix.netcom.com -YY
canoeist@netcom.com                                                mark zen YYY
coan@netcom.com                                                   John Coan YYY
gimlack@netcom.com                                           Eric Rosenberg YYY
grnwave@netcom.com                                           Lynne O'Connor YYY
kcgov1@chiba.netxn.com                          Kern Council of Governments YYN
jflude@nkf1.nkf.com                                              John Flude YYY
mamula@washington.nwlink.com                                  Donald Mamula YNY
dorst@pajoco.com                                               Steven Dorst YYY
lrudolph@panix.com                                              Lee Rudolph YYY
gramling@PascoUSA.com                                         Wade Gramling --Y
orc@pell.com                                                  david parsons NNN
tom_wharton@usa.pipeline.com                              Thomas R. Wharton YYY
sprc@pipeline.com                     Tony Giordano/Sunset Park Restoration YYY
kim@shell.portal.com                                           Kim DeVaughn YYY
hansonm@primenet.com                                 Martin J. Hanson, P.E. YYY
mmt@RedBrick.COM                                              M Mike Taksar ---
dfisch@rmii.com                                     Dick Fischbach@rmii.com YYY
masso@scubed.com                                            Joseph F. Masso --Y
dpm3@dpm3.seanet.com                                          Dan Morisseau NNN
pamur@pamur.seanet.com                                       William Murray YYY
msb@sq.com                                                      Mark Brader --Y
rkniefel@madison.tdsnet.com                                   R. W. Kniefel YYY
davidsen@tmr.com                                              Bill Davidsen YYY
ed.prior@vonline.com                                               Ed Prior YYY
khowie@vertex.worldweb.com                                   J. Keith Howie YYY
friedrich@coke.stud.fh-heilbronn.de
                           friedrich@stud.fh-heilbronn.de, Holger Friedrich Y-Y
stolting@math.fu-berlin.de                                 Gregor Stoelting NNN
nhoffm@in-kiel.de                                          Norbert Hoffmann YYY
list-votes@dream.hb.north.de                               Martin Schr"oder YYY
sven.manias@STUD.UNI-KARLSRUHE.DE                               Sven Manias Y-Y
hanneek@i4.auc.dk                                             Hanne Karlsen Y--
sparre@fys.ku.dk                                      Jacob Sparre Andersen YYY
tlawson@email.univpubs.american.edu                          Todd C. Lawson YNN
jcdf+@andrew.cmu.edu                                 James J. Corbett, P.E. YYY
cls48@columbia.edu                                            Chris Stamper YYY
escharff@CS.Cornell.EDU                                        Eric Scharff NNN
d.greenberger@cornell.edu                              David J. Greenberger Y-Y
ryang@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu                                    G. Patrick Ryan NNN
john@iastate.edu                                               john hascall YYY
sulanke@needmore.physics.indiana.edu                           Thom Sulanke YY-
arromdee@blaze.cs.jhu.edu                                      Ken Arromdee N--
grabowsk@lemoyne.edu                                       Martha Grabowski YY-
patl@lcs.mit.edu                                        Patrick J. LoPresti NNN
hnishida@MIT.EDU                                            Hiroshi Nishida YYY
eric@aristotle.ils.nwu.edu                                Eric D. Goldstein YYY
crh@nwu.edu                                                    C.R. Hinners NYY
k-cuddeback@nwu.edu                                         Kevin Cuddeback YYY
trainman@nwu.edu                                              Jim Ellwanger YYY
goodmanj@HELLGATE.CS.NYU.EDU                                   John Goodman YYY
kinsler@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu                                   Mark Kinsler YYY
mlp2@psu.edu                                              Michael L. Patten YYY
Scot_Osterweil@hub.terc.edu                                  Scot Osterweil YYY
rick@bcm.tmc.edu                                             Richard Miller YYY
smarry@turing.toronto.edu                                      Smarasderagd N-N
twpierce@midway.uchicago.edu                                     Tim Pierce YNN
raman@ganymede.its.uci.edu                                Balaji Ramanathan YYY
hermit@cats.ucsc.edu                                                        NYY
lancec@cats.ucsc.edu                                             Lance Chun NNN
j-grout@uiuc.edu                                              John R. Grout YYY
mwdaniel@uiuc.edu                                              Mike Daniels YYY
afabbro@us.itd.umich.edu                                      Andrew Fabbro N--
hetrick@umr.edu                                           Robert D. Hetrick YYY
cmeinel@unm.edu                                              Carolyn Meinel YYY
smiths@pobox.upenn.edu                                  Sandy F. Smith, Jr. YYY
rudge@eng.usf.edu                                              Daniel Rudge YYN
brettl@mail.utexas.edu                                          Brett Leach -Y-
brett@utexas.edu                       Brett Leach <brettl@mail.utexas.edu> -Y-
beimborn@csd.uwm.edu                                            E. Beimborn YYY
haase@csd.uwm.edu               Richard M. Haase <haase@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu> YYY
hmw4c@watt.seas.virginia.edu                                   Helen Walter --Y
rufinus@mbe.ece.wisc.edu                                         J. Rufinus YYY
elmer@WPI.EDU                                                 Andrew Toppan YYY
una.smith@yale.edu                                                Una Smith YYY
widenius@cc.helsinki.fi                                      Risto Widenius NNN
litaizse@poincare.esstin.u-nancy.fr                              S. LITAIZE YY-
jmoriniere@humana.univ-nantes.fr                      Jean-Michel MORINIERE YYY
t7art@t7ws.dot.ca.gov                                               Salazar YYY
abrandt@trmx2.dot.ca.gov                                      Andrew Brandt --Y
dreeves@trmx2.dot.ca.gov                                     Reeves, Dennis -NY
b_nbca@dante.lbl.gov                                          Bruce Nordman YYY
cynthia.bradshaw@metrokc.gov                               cynthia bradshaw YYY
darohn@giganext.lerc.nasa.gov                               Douglas A. Rohn YYY
mbt@washington.cospo.osis.gov                                               YY-
ljacobso@mail.wsdot.wa.gov                                     Les Jacobson YYY
dfv@WSDOT.WA.GOV                                           DFV@wsdot.wa.gov Y-Y
cvyuval@techunix.technion.ac.il                                 Yuval Hadas YYY
markus.wiedemeier@galactica.it                            Markus Wiedemeier YYY
grolo@dist.dist.unige.it                                      Sergio Grosso YYY
hase@naoe.eng.osaka-u.ac.jp                               Kazuhiko Hasegawa YYY
greg@avalon.ncel.navy.mil                                       Greg Ramsey YYY
jsmith@mmd1.qedwdc.spear.navy.mil                          Jeffrey H. Smith -Y-
psindprunier@gamma.rdc.uscg.mil                             P. Sind-Prunier YY-
sabre@sabri.pc.my                                      S.M.Sabri S.M.Ismail YYY
andrew.shoemaker@bev.net                                     Andy Shoemaker YYY
desai@Capital.Net                                                           YYY
rnewman@cybercom.net                                             Ron Newman YYY
shag@emanon.net                                                Dan Birchall YN-
Ollivier.Robert@hsc.fr.net                                  Ollivier Robert NNN
pfmjones@inforamp.net                    Peter Jones (pfmjones@inforamp.net YYY
rhall@campus.mci.net                                           Richard Hall Y-Y
hmtomson@nando.net                                           Harry Thompson YYY
grobe@netins.net                                             Jonathan Grobe YYY
ppijnack@inter.nl.net                                       Peter Pijnacker -Y-
fransang@pi.net                                             Frans Angevaare YNY
wakelyn@pinn.net                                              N. T. WAKELYN NYY
hughesjf@slip.net                                            John F. Hughes -Y-
bresnab@tiac.net                                            Brian Bresnahan NNN
Peter-Lawrence.Montgomery@cwi.nl                        Peter L. Montgomery YYY
U249011@vm.uci.kun.nl                                    Rian van der Borgt YYY
herb2@nnet.nedernet.nl                                         Herb Miedema YYY
ROTHEN@trc.RUG.NL                                         J.A. Rothengatter Y--
csaamw@urc.tue.nl                                            Michiel Wijers NNN
cfbd@southern.co.nz                                        Colin Douthwaite NNY
glen.koorey@wesv01.wcs.co.nz                 Glen Koorey <wegkf0@wcs.co.nz> Y-Y
rjex@cpcug.org                                                  Rex Edwards -Y-
STONE_L@Eisner.DECUS.Org                                                    YYY
jonboy@io.org                                                Trevor Tymchuk YYY
torport@io.org              Dennis Peter (on behalf of The Port of Toronto) -Y-
mmitchel@libertynet.org                          Matthew D. Mitchell, Ph.D. YYY
carter.r@portseattle.org                                     Richard Carter YYY
gbyshenk@prairienet.org                                  Gregory M. Byshenk YYY
roligt@kulog.upm.edu.ph                                       Roli Talampas YY-
ahlstrom@fy.chalmers.se                                      Peter Ahlstr|m YYY
bo.bjulen@mailbox.swipnet.se                                      Bo Bjulen YY-
A.H.Henry@bath.ac.uk                                           Andrew Henry YYY
d.whyman@bham.ac.uk                                              Dan Whyman YYY
mhe1000@cus.cam.ac.uk                                       Dr. M. H. Evans -Y-
smsmwj1@thor.cf.ac.uk                                         Michael Jones YYY
pjh1@leicester.ac.uk                                            Pete Humble Y-Y
E.A.Tier@newcastle.ac.uk                                           Liz Tier -Y-
M.R.A.K.Kattan@newcastle.ac.uk                               M.R.A.K.KATTAN YYY
J.Chudley@plymouth.ac.uk                                    Dr John Chudley -Y-
g_lyons@meng.ucl.ac.uk                                            G J Lyons -Y-
mapbs@csv.warwick.ac.uk                                         Rolf Mantel Y-N
roger@scho-rjh.demon.co.uk                              Roger J H Schofield -Y-
icm281@easynet.co.uk                                          Ian MacGregor -Y-
scott@innotts.co.uk                                            Scott Walker YYY
HANSEN@quantime.co.uk                                   Christian P. Hansen YYY
J.M.REES@dfr.maff.gov.uk                                  Jon Rees AEP3 DFR YYY
R.O.JOLLIFFE@dfr.maff.gov.uk                                   R O Jolliffe YY-
W.HARDING@dfr.maff.gov.uk                           William Harding MIG DFR YYY
RI002@isgsup.dot.state.az.us                                   David Parker --Y
japalen@dcn.davis.ca.us                 japalen@dcn.davis.ca.us (Joe Palen) --Y
mmullen@owens.ridgecrest.ca.us                               Merritt Mullen YYY
turn@Enigma.metro2.k12.mn.us                                                YYY
JCOWSERT@pmu.dot.state.nc.us                                Jack E. Cowsert YYY
Cole.F.MULLIS@state.or.us                                    Cole F. Mullis --Y
joeshaw@joeshaw.bevc.blacksburg.va.us                              Joe Shaw YYY
rje@ing1.rau.ac.za                                       Roelof Engelbrecht YYY
BGass@transprt.csir.co.za                    Gass, Brendon             3901 YYY

Invalid ballots
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
rdouglas@nova.umuc.edu                                       Robert D. Douglass
    ! No vote statement in message
2 ballots voided for adjudged vote fraud
