From cks@hawkwind.utcs.toronto.edu Fri Nov 12 15:55:43 1993 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: cks@hawkwind.utcs.toronto.edu (Chris Siebenmann) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,comp.sys.dec,comp.sys.hp.hpux,comp.unix.user-friendly,comp.unix.misc,comp.unix.questions Subject: RFD: comp.unix.advocacy Followup-To: news.groups Date: 11 Nov 1993 13:38:00 -0500 Organization: Ziebmef home away from home Lines: 27 Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net Approved: tale@uunet.uu.net Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:4259 news.groups:87381 comp.sys.dec:20396 comp.sys.hp.hpux:880 comp.unix.user-friendly:1191 comp.unix.misc:11491 comp.unix.questions:63127 PROPOSED GROUP: comp.unix.advocacy (unmoderated) CHARTER: For discussions of the form 'Unix sucks!', 'Unix rules!', 'Unix is obsolete!', 'Unix is better/worse than system X', and similar. RATIONAL: Discussions of this form currently infest various other groups where they are generally not wanted; the most visible current example is in comp.sys.dec and comp.sys.hp, with comp.unix.user-friendly arguably overrun by them; past discussions have happened on comp.unix.misc and comp.unix.questions, among others. Creation of a comp.unix.advocacy newsgroup would create a place for people interested in such discussions to hold them without disrupting other newsgroups, along the line of other .advocacy groups. Caution: If you have comments that you want to make sure I read, please send a copy to me by email, as I may miss a comment posted to news.groups. -- I never worry about a factor of two. The problem is, neither do nine of my friends. - Stu Feldman cks@hawkwind.utcs.toronto.edu ...!{utgpu,utzoo,watmath}!utgpu!cks From rdippold@qualcomm.com Thu Dec 2 16:59:23 1993 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: rdippold@qualcomm.com (Ron "Asbestos" Dippold) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,comp.unix.misc,comp.unix.user-friendly,comp.unix.questions,comp.sys.dec,comp.sys.hp Subject: CFV: comp.unix.advocacy Followup-To: poster Date: 2 Dec 1993 01:24:07 -0500 Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers Lines: 44 Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net Approved: tale@uunet.uu.net Expires: 24 Dec 1993 00:00:00 GMT Message-ID: References: Reply-To: voting@qualcomm.com (Ron Dippold Voting Alias) NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:4360 news.groups:89207 comp.unix.misc:11856 comp.unix.user-friendly:1607 comp.unix.questions:64213 comp.sys.dec:20797 comp.sys.hp:41639 FIRST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2) unmoderated group comp.unix.advocacy Newsgroups line: comp.unix.advocacy Arguments for and against Unix and Unix versions. Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 23 Dec 1993. This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party. For voting questions only contact rdippold@qualcomm.com. For questions about the proposed group contact Chris Siebenmann . CHARTER For discussions of the form 'Unix sucks!', 'Unix rules!', 'Unix is obsolete!', 'Unix is better/worse than system X', 'Unix X is better/worse than Unix Y', and similar. Discussions of this form currently infest various other groups where they are generally not wanted; the most visible current example is in comp.sys.dec and comp.sys.hp, with comp.unix.user-friendly arguably overrun by them; past discussions have happened on comp.unix.misc and comp.unix.questions, among others. Creation of a comp.unix.advocacy newsgroup would create a place for people interested in such discussions to hold them without disrupting other newsgroups, along the line of other .advocacy groups. HOW TO VOTE Send MAIL to: voting@qualcomm.com Your mail message should contain one of the following statements: I vote YES on comp.unix.advocacy I vote NO on comp.unix.advocacy You may also ABSTAIN in place of YES/NO - this will not affect the outcome. Anything else may be rejected by the automatic vote counting program. The votetaker will respond to your received ballots with a personal acknowledge- ment by mail - if you do not receive one within several days, try again. It's your responsibility to make sure your vote is registered correctly. Only one vote per person and per account will be counted. Addresses and votes of all voters will be published in the final voting results list. From rdippold@qualcomm.com Thu Dec 2 17:00:37 1993 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: rdippold@qualcomm.com (Ron "Asbestos" Dippold) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,comp.unix.misc,comp.unix.user-friendly,comp.unix.questions,comp.sys.dec,comp.sys.hp Subject: CFV: comp.unix.advocacy Followup-To: poster Date: 2 Dec 1993 01:24:07 -0500 Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers Lines: 44 Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net Approved: tale@uunet.uu.net Expires: 24 Dec 1993 00:00:00 GMT Message-ID: References: Reply-To: voting@qualcomm.com (Ron Dippold Voting Alias) NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:4360 news.groups:89207 comp.unix.misc:11856 comp.unix.user-friendly:1607 comp.unix.questions:64213 comp.sys.dec:20797 comp.sys.hp:41639 FIRST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2) unmoderated group comp.unix.advocacy Newsgroups line: comp.unix.advocacy Arguments for and against Unix and Unix versions. Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 23 Dec 1993. This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party. For voting questions only contact rdippold@qualcomm.com. For questions about the proposed group contact Chris Siebenmann . CHARTER For discussions of the form 'Unix sucks!', 'Unix rules!', 'Unix is obsolete!', 'Unix is better/worse than system X', 'Unix X is better/worse than Unix Y', and similar. Discussions of this form currently infest various other groups where they are generally not wanted; the most visible current example is in comp.sys.dec and comp.sys.hp, with comp.unix.user-friendly arguably overrun by them; past discussions have happened on comp.unix.misc and comp.unix.questions, among others. Creation of a comp.unix.advocacy newsgroup would create a place for people interested in such discussions to hold them without disrupting other newsgroups, along the line of other .advocacy groups. HOW TO VOTE Send MAIL to: voting@qualcomm.com Your mail message should contain one of the following statements: I vote YES on comp.unix.advocacy I vote NO on comp.unix.advocacy You may also ABSTAIN in place of YES/NO - this will not affect the outcome. Anything else may be rejected by the automatic vote counting program. The votetaker will respond to your received ballots with a personal acknowledge- ment by mail - if you do not receive one within several days, try again. It's your responsibility to make sure your vote is registered correctly. Only one vote per person and per account will be counted. Addresses and votes of all voters will be published in the final voting results list. From rdippold@qualcomm.com Tue Dec 14 14:23:44 1993 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: rdippold@qualcomm.com (Ron "Asbestos" Dippold) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,comp.unix.misc,comp.unix.user-friendly,comp.unix.questions,comp.sys.dec,comp.sys.hp Subject: 2nd CFV: comp.unix.advocacy Supersedes: Followup-To: poster Date: 13 Dec 1993 15:02:24 -0500 Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers Lines: 48 Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net Approved: tale@uunet.uu.net Expires: 24 Dec 1993 00:00:00 GMT Message-ID: References: Reply-To: voting@qualcomm.com (Ron Dippold Voting Alias) NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:4403 news.groups:90056 comp.unix.misc:12050 comp.unix.user-friendly:2021 comp.unix.questions:64695 comp.sys.dec:21006 comp.sys.hp:41905 LAST CALL FOR VOTES (of 2) unmoderated group comp.unix.advocacy Newsgroups line: comp.unix.advocacy Arguments for and against Unix and Unix versions. Votes must be received by 23:59:59 UTC, 23 Dec 1993. This vote is being conducted by a neutral third party. For voting questions only contact rdippold@qualcomm.com. For questions about the proposed group contact Chris Siebenmann . CHARTER For discussions of the form 'Unix sucks!', 'Unix rules!', 'Unix is obsolete!', 'Unix is better/worse than system X', 'Unix X is better/worse than Unix Y', and similar. Discussions of this form currently infest various other groups where they are generally not wanted; the most visible current example is in comp.sys.dec and comp.sys.hp, with comp.unix.user-friendly arguably overrun by them; past discussions have happened on comp.unix.misc and comp.unix.questions, among others. Creation of a comp.unix.advocacy newsgroup would create a place for people interested in such discussions to hold them without disrupting other newsgroups, along the line of other .advocacy groups. HOW TO VOTE Send MAIL to: voting@qualcomm.com Your mail message should contain one of the following statements: I vote YES on comp.unix.advocacy I vote NO on comp.unix.advocacy You may also ABSTAIN in place of YES/NO - this will not affect the outcome. Anything else may be rejected by the automatic vote counting program. The votetaker will respond to your received ballots with a personal acknowledge- ment by mail - if you do not receive one within several days, try again. It's your responsibility to make sure your vote is registered correctly. Only one vote per person and per account will be counted. Addresses and votes of all voters will be published in the final voting results list. comp.unix.advocacy group vote Bounce Ack List - no need to revote ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ pk@sarnoff.com From rdippold@qualcomm.com Mon Jan 3 17:49:46 1994 Path: uunet!bounce-back From: rdippold@qualcomm.com (Ron "Asbestos" Dippold) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,comp.unix.misc,comp.unix.user-friendly,comp.unix.questions,comp.sys.dec,comp.sys.hp Subject: RESULT: comp.unix.advocacy passes 164:32 Supersedes: Followup-To: news.groups Date: 3 Jan 1994 16:58:30 -0500 Organization: Usenet Volunteer Votetakers Lines: 239 Sender: tale@uunet.uu.net Approved: tale@uunet.uu.net Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: rodan.uu.net Xref: uunet news.announce.newgroups:4433 news.groups:91316 comp.unix.misc:12351 comp.unix.user-friendly:2315 comp.unix.questions:65355 comp.sys.dec:21279 comp.sys.hp:42269 unmoderated comp.unix.advocacy group vote passes 164:32 There were 164 YES votes and 32 NO votes, for a total of 196 valid votes. There was 1 abstain. For group passage, YES votes must be at least 2/3 of all valid (YES and NO) votes. There also must be at least 100 more YES votes than NO votes. Thus, the group passes. There is a five day discussion period after these results are posted. If no serious allegations of voting irregularities are raised, the moderator of news.announce.newgroups will create the group shortly thereafter. Newsgroups line: comp.unix.advocacy Arguments for and against Unix and Unix versions. This vote was conducted by a neutral third party. For voting questions only contact rdippold@qualcomm.com. For questions about the proposed group contact Chris Siebenmann . CHARTER For discussions of the form 'Unix sucks!', 'Unix rules!', 'Unix is obsolete!', 'Unix is better/worse than system X', 'Unix X is better/worse than Unix Y', and similar. comp.unix.advocacy group vote Final Vote Ack Yes Votes ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ a905576@tiuk.ti.com David Pardoe aadt!todd@uunet.UU.NET Todd Richmond adams@maths.mu.OZ.AU Tim Adam akonstan@math.macalstr.edu Alexander Konstantinou allyn@richsun.cpg.trs.reuter.com Allyn Barnett amanda@iesd.auc.dk Per Abrahamsen andras@concave.cs.wits.ac.za Andras Salamon ANDREWH@EARLHAM.EDU Andrew W. Hagen anthony.baxter@aaii.oz.au anthony baxter arane@ips.iac.honeywell.com Abhijit P. Rane art@cyclone.mitre.org Arthur T. McClinton Arthur.Chance@Smallworld.co.uk Arthur Chance ault@cs.albany.edu aw1@stade.co.uk Adrian Wontroba bailey@hagar.ph.utexas.edu Ed Bailey barr@pop.psu.edu David Barr bengtl@maths.lth.se Bengt Larsson bill@wicat.COM Bill Swinyard bj@herbison.com B.J. Herbison bouillon@cs.uni-sb.de Peter G. Bouillon bryan@Novell.COM Bryan Cardoza cburley@binkley.cs.mcgill.ca Craig William BURLEY cgd@postgres.Berkeley.EDU Chris G. Demetriou chip%fin.uucp@dg-rtp.dg.com Chip Salzenberg chris@tali.hsc.colorado.edu Chris Yoder chrisj@hpman010.uksr.hp.com Chris James chuahl@cory.EECS.Berkeley.EDU Chua Hak Lien cjensen@netcom.com Colin Jensen cks@hawkwind.utcs.toronto.edu Chris Siebenmann cmacleod@mcs.dundee.ac.uk Colin Macleod cmc@brandx.cs.ohiou.edu C Matthew Curtin coar@am_nephi.bxbmts.bxb.MTS.dec.com Ken Coar - Ce que je fais est secret. collins@paros.com Jeff Collins cracauer@wavehh.hanse.de Martin Cracauer craffert@lehman.com Colin Owen Rafferty cvs06922@Menudo.UH.EDU Carl Streeter damercer@mmm.com David.Black@newcastle.ac.uk dbrown@ai.uga.edu Daniel Brown [MSAI] dem@hep.net David E. Martin dgfritz@cat.syr.edu Doug Fritz dmurphy@cwa.com Dan Murphy donovan@bnr.ca marc (m.) donovan dougmc@utpapa.ph.utexas.edu Doug McLaren drayer@minerva.cis.yale.edu Rebecca Drayer drosenfe@motown.ge.com dwe@eng.iac.honeywell.com eck@syl.nj.nec.com ed@unican.gts.org Ed Borkovsky edsr!jem@uunet.UU.NET John E. Mendenhall edwardb@netcom.com Edward Baichtal falko@ikmfbs.ing.tu-bs.de Falko Sauermann fcamara@tid.es Fco. J. Ballesteros fischer@dina.kvl.dk Lars Peter Fischer fox@netcom.com Fuzzy Fox Garrett.Wollman@UVM.EDU Garrett Wollman gedtdc!pjt@uu6.psi.com ggw@acpub.duke.edu G. "Wolfe" Woodbury gibson@khan.tam.cornell.edu John Gibson glreno@afterlife.ncsc.mil Gerald Reno gre@riot.enet.dec.com Gwyn Evans greyham@research.canon.oz.au Graham Stoney gspear+@CMU.EDU Geoffrey Spear guezou_p@epita.fr philippe guezou harle@ward.NADN.NAVY.MIL Jim Harle harley@gotit.shr.dec.com Harley Privitera hayden@krypton.mankato.msus.edu Robert A. Hayden heilmayr@math.berkeley.edu Stephan Heilmayr hm@fwi.uva.nl Hans Mulder hp90101@internet.sbi.com Harry Protoolis hpa@nwu.edu H. Peter Anvin N9ITP hriquelm@impreza.adm.indumotora.cl Hictor Riquelme Lizama jamantle@maplesoft.on.ca Jim Mantle Jarkko.Hietaniemi@hut.fi Jarkko Hietaniemi jarvidss@seaut.abb.se jason@oaknet.oaknet.com Jason Vanick jds@cs.UMD.EDU James da Silva jeffo@uiuc.edu J.B. Nicholson-Owens jhenders@jonh.wimsey.bc.ca John Henders jmaynard@nyx10.cs.du.edu Jay Maynard jmrosens@students.wisc.edu Jesse M. Rosenstock jms@tardis.Tymnet.COM Joe Smith jnemeth@cue.bc.ca John Nemeth john@xsoft.xerox.com John Raithel johnh@FICUS.CS.UCLA.EDU John Heidemann jum@anubis.han.de Jens-Uwe Mager jws@cs.mu.OZ.AU Jeff Schultz jxv3790@hertz.njit.edu Jake Vogelaar jxxl@cs.nps.navy.mil John Locke kai@phantom.com Kai kenji@k2r.or.jp Kenji Rikitake khoub-s@cs.buffalo.edu Siamak Khoubyari kjetilho@ifi.uio.no Kjetil Torgrim Homme L15D@ZFN.uni-bremen.de Martin Schroeder lan_lada@aaf.alcatel.at Marino Ladavac lee@auriga.rose.brandeis.edu charles lee ler@lerami.lerctr.org Larry Rosenman lincoln@prospero.sp.flinders.edu.au Lincoln Turner linimon@lonesome.com Mark Linimon lonadar@judy.indstate.edu Lonadar the Wanderer lootens@luc.ac.be Eddy Lootens loren@wmkt.wharton.upenn.edu Loren Miller magnus@ii.uib.no Magnus Y Alvestad majid@inf.enst.fr Fazal Majid mazzarel@math.berkeley.edu Ariel Mazzarelli mcampbel@schubert.sbi.com Mike Campbell mercierm@JSP.UMontreal.CA Mercier Mathieu mikew@gopher.dosli.govt.nz Mike Williams misar@rbg.informatik.th-darmstadt.de mjshield@nyx10.cs.du.edu Michael Shields mlee@cat.syr.edu Mowcheng Lee mlevis@ringer.cs.utsa.edu Mike Levis - OS/2 2.1 GA mmt@RedBrick.COM Maxime Taksar KC6ZPS mss1@cornell.edu Michael Scott Shappe muir@idiom.berkeley.ca.us David Muir Sharnoff neeri@iis.ee.ethz.ch Matthias Neeracher nigel@socs.uts.EDU.AU Nigel Pearson ove@astro.lu.se Ove Hagerbo patrick.m.ryan@gsfc.nasa.gov patrick m. ryan pcatsc!spwvsd!spwvsd!jeff%dptspd.UUCP Jeff Brooks peter@gate1.nmti.com Peter da Silva peter@zeus.dialix.oz.au Peter Wemm petes@hpindck.cup.hp.com Pete Smoot phoffman@netcom.com Paul E. Hoffman pk@sarnoff.com prashanth poc@usb.ve Patrick O'Callaghan pressy@tetra.north.de Carsten Bormann prg@rampart.rco.qc.ca David McCabe - Progress Programmer pzola@us.oracle.com Paul Zola quinn@phoenix.Princeton.EDU Michael J. Quinn rahardj@CC.UManitoba.CA rbagnall@au.oracle.com rbagnall.AU revco@revco.med.yale.edu Jim Revkin revu@midway.uchicago.edu Sendhil Revuluri rick@bcm.tmc.edu Richard H. Miller rolfe@ldp.com Rolfe Tessem root@yclept.chi.il.us Root a.k.a. Randolph J. Herber -- owner-sysadmin rv@cs.brown.edu Rodrigo Vanegas schow@bnr.ca stanley (s.t.h.) chow scs@eskimo.com Steve Summit SILVEIRA@inf.ufrgs.br Fernando da Silveira Montenegro sjsmith@cs.UMD.EDU Stephen Joseph Smith sltheria@artsci.wustl.edu Seth L Theriault SRK106@PSUVM.PSU.EDU Senthil R. Kumar steve@Wattres.SJ.CA.US Steve Watt -- KD6GGD sutela@utu.fi Kari Sutela suzio@chmar2.srl.ford.com Mike Suzio swildner@channelz.gun.de Sascha Wildner SYSBXR@SUVM.SYR.EDU Bridget Rutty tar@matt.ksu.ksu.edu Tim Ramsey tep@nwg.nectec.or.th Pornthep Narula terry@tyrell.net Terry McDill Timo.Rinne@hut.fi Timo Rinne tomas@u30003.rsv.svskt.se Tomas Ruden Tony_Porczyk@Novell.COM Tony Porczyk usingh@mailbox.syr.edu Uminder Singh vamsee@softint.com Vamsee Lakamsani vogon1!frackit!dave@cse.psu.edu Dave Ratcliffe vpl8747@u.cc.utah.edu Ville Lavonius walra%moacs11@NL.net Waldi Ravens wb@roka.de Wilhelm Buehler windsord@basf-corp.com David L Windsor wrs@nlbbs.com William Smith yadallee@galcon.ersys.edmonton.ab.ca Dave Shariff Yadallee No Votes ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ burt+@CMU.EDU Burt N Holzman ckk@uchicago.edu Christopher K. Koenigsberg davidp@qpsx.oz.au David Pascoe davidsen@tmr.com Bill Davidsen dmarcher@acsu.buffalo.edu fsspr@camelot.acf-lab.alaska.edu Sean P. Ryan gcarter@infoserv.com George Carter gl8f@fermi.clas.virginia.edu Greg Lindahl hahn@cortex.lrdc.pitt.edu mark hahn hollasch@kpc.com Steve Hollasch jan@bagend.atl.ga.us Jan Isley jan@filetek.com Jan Morales jgd@dixie.com John De Armond joel@wam.umd.edu Joel M. Hoffman john@uhs1.uhs.uga.edu John D. Hopkins jrm@globalvillag.com John "Fax This!" MacWilliamson kevinmac@ll.mit.edu Kevin McElearney lon@chs.com Lon Jones magnus@thep.lu.se Magnus Olsson masticol@scr.siemens.com Steve Masticola neilb@tucumcari.eece.unm.edu ogj@tglobe2.tollpost.no Oyvind Gjerstad rws3n@karma.astro.virginia.edu Robert W. Spiker SAAST8@vms.cis.pitt.edu shane@spr.com Shane Hartman sheldon@iastate.edu smarry@io.org Smarasderagd srogers@tad.eds.com Steve Rogers tchrist@wraeththu.cs.colorado.edu Tom Christiansen teffta@cs690-3.erie.ge.com Andrew R. Tefft tinsel@uiuc.edu Thomas Aaron Insel wirzeniu@cc.helsinki.fi Lars Wirzenius Abstaining Votes ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ pace@shell.com Stephen O. Pace